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Comment by alex43578 | original | Lawmakers added $1 to car insurance policies. That money paid for Flock cameras
[−]alex43578 · 2026-08-30 Sun 06:55 UTC · link
"Right to privacy" isn't a specific right in the US. Furthermore, being in the middle of a public roadway in a registered vehicle shouldn't confer the expectation of privacy, per Katz. Probably the closest case law is Carpenter, which only covers cell data and was specifically meant to apply narrowly to that type of info.
[−]moralestapia · 2026-08-30 Sun 07:04 UTC · link
Ok, it's not called a "right", it's the fourth amendment, and federal statutes and state laws and whatnot.

You got me there, pal ;) I didn't use the exact technical terms you expected, my argument is now void, nooo.

I guess I should go and install one of those cameras right outside my house now.

[−]alex43578 · 2026-08-30 Sun 07:18 UTC · link
"The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures" in case you forgot.

I'm not saying you have to reply in a technical term - just explain how being seen and recorded driving down a public street, in a vehicle that's required to display an identifiable plate you've registered with the government, constitutes a search, seizure, or even an invasion of your privacy.

Nobody's saying you have to install a camera outside your house (ignoring the dozens of cameras your neighbors have willingly installed to replace their doorbell or to deter theft/burglary). But you can't argue that the government or private businesses can't deploy cameras because you expect privacy in the middle of a road.

[−]filoeleven · 2026-08-30 Sun 13:19 UTC · link
[−]alex43578 · 2026-08-30 Sun 13:32 UTC · link
“Individuals have reasonable expectations of privacy in their cell phone location information. The court did not hold that geofence warrants are unconstitutional
[−]aqme28 · 2026-08-30 Sun 13:12 UTC · link
> being in the middle of a public roadway in a registered vehicle shouldn't confer the expectation of privacy

And this is where US caselaw and my personal beliefs about privacy start to differ. Why can't we expect some level of privacy in a public place? There are some countries that confer that, to certain levels.

[−]alex43578 · 2026-08-30 Sun 14:50 UTC · link
“Why can't we expect some level of privacy in a public place?”

Because it’s a public place. We already have laws covering things like harassment, voyeurism, etc; so existing legal conduct in a public place should remain legal.

[−]disposition2 · 2026-08-30 Sun 16:30 UTC · link
> Why can't we expect some level of privacy in a public place? There are some countries that confer that, to certain levels.

The US used to be one of those countries, then 9/11 happened and the loudest folks (or at least the folks with the most money to influence law) started eroding privacy and now more folks just accept our current state and views like OP’s.

It’s really interesting…you can even watch a TV crime drama series, like Law & Order, and see the privacy erosion in the TV show. That transition is basically a reflection of what happened in the US.

[−]diydsp · 2026-08-30 Sun 14:41 UTC · link
I discussed above how Carpenter is not narrowly restricted to cell phones.

The fact of being in public or on a vehicle isn't the key point. It's that electronic systems aggregating location data are 4th amendment protected. Which was established in Carpenter.

The aggregation creates a comprehensive system.

Aggregated location data over months creates a comprehensive chronicle of your life that's categorically different from someone observing you on one street corner. Aggregation changes the constitutional analysis.

[−]alex43578 · 2026-08-30 Sun 15:06 UTC · link
So to my original point, the Flock camera does not violate any rights. Even the system aggregating the data, like Google or your cell provider, doesn’t violate any rights.

It’s only the government searching that database without a warrant that would be unconstitutional under some hypothetical future case.